The Velvet Forum

mg196 wrote:

Doctor Bob wrote:By the way I remembered that you can listen to some of it on Mr Living Legend's very own myspace site.

It doesn't.

It doesn't what?

Oh sorry, I forgot. Your posts aren't meant to make sense

Hey guys, whatever you think of my sometimes-crazy posts, if you ARE into Moz or The Smiths, please check out my new forum at:

http://mozsmiths.forumotion.com

I hope you'll visit. I get tired of the obnoxious brats on the current Moz/Smiths forums.

Absolutely no competition. Morrisseys sixth form 'poetry' cannot match in any way Lou's stunning lyricism (not that I'm a fan or anything!). The Smiths couldn't maintain an album, its only worth buying 'The World Won't Listen' if you must have something by them. The Smiths were a singles band and most of their best ones were nicked (see Panic - Metal Guru anyone?). The Smiths were Duran Duran for miserablists. I saw them once and it was awful. I'm just disappointed that Johnny Marr has not done anything since The Smiths split. If you want that teenage angst stuff go listen to The Wedding Present - better than The Smiths in every way.

Don't you mean Marr hasn't done anything listenable since?

whitelight wrote:Absolutely no competition. Morrisseys sixth form 'poetry' cannot match in any way Lou's stunning lyricism (not that I'm a fan or anything!). The Smiths couldn't maintain an album, its only worth buying 'The World Won't Listen' if you must have something by them. The Smiths were a singles band and most of their best ones were nicked (see Panic - Metal Guru anyone?). The Smiths were Duran Duran for miserablists. I saw them once and it was awful. I'm just disappointed that Johnny Marr has not done anything since The Smiths split. If you want that teenage angst stuff go listen to The Wedding Present - better than The Smiths in every way.

Usually we don't go around slamming each others' opinions here, but whatever. As I have stated several times in this thread, this is not a "who is better than who." Seems like you have a lot of that "teenage angst" leftover from the 80's.

Anyways, I'll always have my "Disco Mystic" to listen to for a reminder of what great lyrics are all about.

I meant that Johnny Marr hasn't done anything creative since, for such a talented guitarist. And I'm not 'slamming others opinions' at all, if you post a thread like this it will appear that you are comparing Reed and Morrissey and I am venturing an opinion that there really is no comparison. Indeed I wasn't a teenager in the 80's but find Morrisseys 'style' awkward to say the least, he can't match 'Pale Blue Eyes' for example. Also I am not saying that Reed hasn't produced pure garbage (the whole of The Bells is dire IMHO). I have listened to The Smiths and many of Morrisseys solo offerings and fail to see what the appeal is save for Marrs guitar rifs, which are often excellent (What Difference, Panic etc). But in terms of lyrical offerings Morrisseys 'say nothing to me about my life' whereas Reeds do.

whitelight wrote:I'd like to thank Doctor Bob for sticking up for me. I wasn't intending to cause offence by expressing my opinions on The Smiths, Morriseey etc but just to liven things up a bit and generate a healthy debate. I was really hoping that someone would come back with a decent argument about why Morrissey and Reed should be considered peers because to me they appeal to very different audiences.

Well, I don't think they are peers, but I do see them as two artists w/ very similar careers...musically.

Personally, I think Lou's legend was set in stone before he ever went solo. Everything after The Blue Mask I find very tedious. I think his prominence (and his legend) grew in the 1980's largely due to his and his wife's publicity campaign. The charity LP's, charit concerts, American Express ads...

Moz, also from a very important and seminal band (no, not The Nosebleeds) was also legendary before the demise of the band. Unlike Lou, however, Moz always stuck to his guns, never tried to soften his image, and just kept churning out albums and singles. His legend is still ascendant.

One of the big differences between the two is pure musical output. Morrissey has issued so many singles and b-sides it is impossible to count! With Lou, we are pretty much stuck with the LP's...and Nowhere at All.

Now, my original question was:

Who will leave the greater legacy...always being remembered for integrity, poetry, never compromising, and always knowing they were better than everyone else?!

Well, I believe that Moz's legacy will stand taller than Lou's as time rolls on. He has never lost his muse, as Lou seems to have done several times in his career (though he always rebounds). Where Lou relies on his legend to carry his legend forward, Moz creates more music. Would Moz ever deliberately campaign to get his face in the public eye as Lou and Sylvia did? Never. I think that says it all.

I know people disagree with me, but instead of just saying someone sucks and is miserable and is no better than the Thompson Twins or Bread, try explaining your reasons to us!

I don't give much thought to Morrissey, although I did have a few Smiths records. Listened to 'How Soon Is Now' a few weeks ago.
When they split I think I assumed that Marr would be the more important player as he wrote the music, but obviously it's Moz in hindsight.

My one question is does M write any music now? I think Lou's greatest contribution to rnr in the long term will be his songs - words and music, not just words. Isn't that important? There aren't many 'greats' who didn't/don't wrote their own stuff...

The thing about different audiences I think is more about different age groups - in my experience Lou as a solo artist means most to people who were hitting adolescence in the early 70s. I'd guess the Morrissey group would be about 10 years younger?

MG - what age where you when 'This Charming Man' came out?
[it's funny, I look at yr icon and I can't help thinking you look like Johnny Thunders...]

I am not sure if Moz writes any music now. I think he is strictly a songwriter.

simonm wrote:MG - what age where you when 'This Charming Man' came out?

I was probably 10 years old. I still remember this chick, Susan Tucker, in high school who was TOTALLY into the Smiths, wouldn't wear leather, etc...at the time I thought she was nutz!

simonm wrote:it's funny, I look at yr icon and I can't help thinking you look like Johnny Thunders...

Not quite, dude. More like Greg Brady!

mg196 wrote:I was probably 10 years old.

ah well, another theory down the drain.

Greg Brady eh? (Maybe we need a 'who do we look like' thread on the General Discussion side).